Post No.: 0965
Furrywisepuppy says:
‘Pickup artists (PUAs)’ consciously learn about and employ psychological techniques to try to seduce and pick up women. And like a perfect con, they can leave their targets happy to give them what they want, and even leave their targets wanting more.
Learn a saved bank of witty lines. Use Barnum statements to apparently ‘read their souls’ and fabricate deep connections. Contrive moments to touch them or get them to look into your eyes. The heuristic is that more desirable things are harder to obtain so acting aloof and being picky can make you appear higher in status; as will negging someone to put them down. Treat them mean, keep them keen. Play hard to get. Blow hot and cold. Position yourself as the chased, not the chaser.
…But this is all playing games, and pickup artists even call it ‘game’. You could say that those who fall for deliberate manipulation and shallow tricks are suggestible. Is the only difference between a stalker or sexual harasser, and a charmer, whether you reciprocate their attention and fancy? Many people who are charming are psychopathic too.
So I’d personally say be less suggestible against anyone who turns on the superficial charm, bats their eyelashes or uses their sexuality to try to win favours from you. When women try it on men, it doesn’t mean it’s right for them to experience sexual harassment, yet it doesn’t help their reputation, professionalism or combat the stereotypes they’ll reinforce in the fight for gender equality.
Pickup artists simply play the numbers game – they dispassionately approach/pester as many women as they can and hope one or two latch. It’s like spamming hundreds of people and hoping one or two click on a link! So they treat women as mere commodities and use many of the same sales techniques as salespeople do (e.g. to get their ‘foot in the door’ or the ‘presumptive close’). They’re seemingly never without breath mints or gum, either because they’ve got terrible breath and/or because they’re opportunistic and always on the lookout to pull someone. So, like with salespeople, it’s wise to learn about their ways in order to be aware of their tricks. Buy on your terms, as it were.
Not all women will be receptive to ‘negging’ but negging is about subtly (jokily, ‘accidentally’, ambiguously, as a constructive criticism or backhanded compliment) putting a woman down so that she appears lower in status compared to the man, and therefore it’s the man who appears more desirable to her than her to him, which means the woman will feel happy to receive any type of attention from him. Pretty women are particularly not used to being overlooked. So feeling sidelined, jealous and doubting her own desirability, possibly because the man is paying other women more attention – a pretty woman may try hard to get his attention and end up inadvertently being the one chasing him, which was the pickup artist’s plan because he now has the power to restore or reaffirm her belief that she’s attractive and desirable. (It’s somewhat like when commercials try to sell you something – they make you feel insecure; for which a business then claims it can alleviate that insecurity if only you buy its products.) No one likes being especially ignored or rejected so she’ll want to attain his approval. And the harder she works for his attention, the more she’ll desire him.
Real men big-up women because they don’t fear strong, independent and confident women. But I guess this is why being nice from the start and raising the desirability of those who already know they’re highly desired can have the opposite effect on your own desirability (Post No.: 0930 talked about nice guys). Yet negging is such a cheap psychological trick to surreptitiously damage someone’s self-esteem to feel low enough to sleep with you and secure your validation.
If you genuinely like someone then why manipulate them and play games? You cannot relax if you live a lie because you’ll need to constantly maintain it, like if you over-exaggerate your social value, job, adventures, successes, prowess and lifestyle. Your true self will eventually be revealed. These tricks are therefore really only for those who want casual flings.
I guess there’s a subjective distinction between acceptable and unacceptable exaggeration and concealment though – like is using makeup or only disclosing what’s impressive about us count as deceptions? Is knowing that eye contact and physical touch increases the bonding hormone oxytocin unfair? Mayhap in some ways finding love is inevitably a game! People can definitely be manipulated into love (e.g. an undercover cop lied about his identity, life and beliefs, and got someone in the group he was infiltrating to fall in love with him).
It’s easier to pick up guys than gals. Women are more vulnerable compared to men when it comes to dating so must normally be choosier. Women are generally more vulnerable both offline and online than men. Men don’t get pregnant so they can try to mate with as many women as they can, whereas women bear the risk of pregnancy. Contraceptives can occasionally fail, and even where abortion is legal – that’s all a mess that the woman has to deal with. This isn’t to justify the act of men cheating more or having multiple wives. ‘Could’ isn’t the same as ‘should’. ‘Is’ isn’t the same as ‘ought to be’.
At least (ethical) pickup artists acknowledge that it’s only fun if all parties consensually find it fun. When flirting, whether with words or actions, you must always pay attention to whether the other person is enjoying it or not, and if they’re not then back off. Like all body language signals – read them in clusters, not singularly; thus a tactile hug from someone alone doesn’t necessarily mean they’re interested in you sexually.
Consent must be unambiguous and given just before you make a move i.e. not a while ago because they could’ve changed their minds since then. Past consent doesn’t mean present or future consent. And if they fall unconscious, like asleep, then consent cannot be given hence isn’t given. Also, speak out and help those whom you see being potentially sexually harassed.
There can be a fuzzy area between flirting with genuine heartfelt compliments, and harassment. Either party can misread the signals too. It can be tricky to know when it’s okay to compliment someone on their appearance. But if you really like and respect someone then you’d back off as soon as they feel uncomfortable, whatever their level of sensitivity is. (And their verdict is all that matters, whether independent observers think some behaviour was, or wasn’t, considered inappropriate or creepy.) Unwanted conduct of a sexual nature is categorically dishonourable and has no place if you really truly think you love someone. Real love comes with respect. Woof!
People can choose different mates depending on whether they just want a casual fling versus a long-term partner, like high-testosterone men for the former and more nurturing men for the latter. Women on the pill tend to prefer men with slightly less masculine features.
So why are ‘bad boys’ attractive then? How are murderers, thieves and other lawbreakers attractive?! How many people have they beat up to ‘show who’s physically dominant’? …Or if being ‘bad’ and ‘rebellious’ merely means something superficial, like how someone dresses, walks and talks, then it’s just a shallow image(!)
What does it mean to be ‘hard’? It’s harder to be a nice and kind person in this world. It’s harder to build bridges than to break them. And real hard people do the harder things.
But some people like a ‘project’ i.e. someone who’s rough around the edges but ultimately redeemable, and it’s appealing to be the one to redeem them. They like to feel they’ve made a positive impact on and see character growth in them. We generally admire people whom we feel we’ve personally changed for the better, like changing their mind towards our way of thinking. It demonstrates that they listen to, and thus respect, us. We can only compare things relatively, and we read into assumed momentums and trajectories, hence the most improved pupil can be favoured over one who comprehended something from the start – unless we take a step back and compare the pupils side-by-side as opposed to only one of them against their own past. Coming back from 3 goals down to snatch a draw feels better than the match being goalless, even though that’s a draw too.
Ancestral cavemen used to frequently rape women but those who resisted or somehow aborted their offspring were killed, shunned or didn’t have as many children. Those cavewomen who submitted passed on their submissive genetic instincts that expected men to dominate women. But members of all genders can learn and adapt to desire more gender equality today instead of being blind slaves to their genes. Rape survivors shouldn’t just quietly ‘accept it’ but report it, and others must listen. Women must fight, and by that I don’t mean ‘copy the worst aspects of men’, which is what some women think being ‘strong’ means when it isn’t, even with men. People brought up in abusive homes may also think that the way their parents treated each other or them is what love is, or is all they deserve.
Another hypothesis is that the physiological symptoms of attraction and mild threat are broadly similar (e.g. heart palpitating, sweaty palms, shortness of breath, head going topsy-turvy) – and maybe ‘bad boys’ stoke a bit of feeling of risk, which can feel exciting. Some people may similarly confuse anger with sexual arousal, hence the cliché of ‘makeup sex’.
‘Bad boys’ have bad reputations hence we expect less from them. But we should’ve learnt by now to not let certain people off the hook just because we think ‘that’s just the way they always are’ – as in ‘yes he likes flirting with and touching lots of women… but that’s just the way he is’. If anything, we should be more forgiving towards those who do something inappropriate incredibly rarely than regularly, for which the latter are more likely to be the real creeps. The greater truth is in the usual more than the unusual.
With ‘bad boys’, it’s like how a negotiator can suddenly appear like they’re conceding a lot to us by giving us a little when they’ve previously given us nothing. That rare romantic gesture shouldn’t override all the neglect. Meanwhile, nice guys cannot make a single mistake without harming their reputation. It’s like how, as graphics are getting ever more refined in videogames, any small thing that’s out of place jars far greater than it did when graphics were coarser.
The person who has cooked the Christmas lunch for years will get complained at if they suddenly decide not to want to cook it anymore; whereas all those who’ve never cooked it even once before won’t receive any complaints! Our judgements are referenced against our expectations or what we’ve gotten used to, and we expect different people to behave differently. Sometimes it’s fair, like holding children to lower standards than adults, but sometimes it’s not.
So we can take good people for granted and be overly lenient on those held to lower expectations. It’s silly to reason that you know what you’re getting with bad people! Even a slew of major misdeeds mightn’t ruin their support and careers (even if they were a former head of state!) Everyone should be held to the exact same standards, regarding sexual harassment at least, no matter their status or wealth.
How can it be self-respecting to fancy a known player too? The hubris is in thinking you’ll be the one to get them to finally commit.
Woof. We’re not always rational when it comes to attraction. Lust is arguably simpler whereas love can be complicated. Nevertheless, it’s helpful to know the difference between the two.
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